Jordan Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 5 minutes ago, Alek said: I understand the scary black rifle concept. The American people elected a president who would protect and give more gun rights for this crazy notion of "keeping our government in check with a well armed militia". He overturned a completely logical regulation that prevented people with mental health issues from purchasing a firearm capable of punching holes through walls, 30 rounds at a time (not a musket). What we got was a school full of children dead and a militia that is still completely outmatched by the logistical and weapon superiority of the government. Yeah, the useless party-pandering is dangerous, but it's what the 2 party system has created. I think we are really discussing a much larger scale revolution. We are in the realm of amending the constitution and abandoning the two-party system if we want real change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 hour ago, ez11 said: switzerland has just as many guns per person US have literally x4 more per person Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Imagine said: Too easy to get and own guns. An 18-year-old gets expelled on Friday can buy an AR on Saturday? Someone previously on the no-fly list can buy an AR? You can walk into a gun show, buy whatever you want and never have to show and ID. The argument that "they will get them anyway" is complete trash. The fact of the matter is the last 3 biggest mass shooting in the US the shooter have gotten their guns from stores. The argument that we need AR's and military weapons in case the government turns on us, is fucking stupid. When the 2nd amendment was written the government had shitty guns and so did the people, fair game. Now the government has tanks, planes, submarines, drones, nukes. Anyway, I proudly conceal carry and am not for a weapons ban, but there definitely needs to be some drastic changes to gun laws. I digress It was and has been proven wrong; that you actually cannot "go into an gun show and purchase a gun without showing ID". I do agree with you that the US needs to up their game in terms of background checks... possibly modeling Japan's interviewing process. The Stoneman shooter should never have gotten a gun had this process taken place. Local background checks / interviewing of multiple people around the applicant / Character references, such as teachers should all be part of the gun-applicant, process. To talk about Stoneman, the system failed. There were 3 police ON SITE during the course of the shooting and they did nothing to stop the shooter. Among the 30+ calls to the police warning of this living devil. Take away his guns maybe? Might of worked, but than logically speaking, whats stopping him from creating bombs and amassing the same amount of dead if not more? The point is guns don't kill people, people kill people. The argument that we need weapons to protect yourself is very valid. Refer to the genocide that killed over ~6 million jews. With someone like trump as your president mocking other countrys, why would you not want some way to protect yourself.... the sheriffs at Stoneman who were on site during the 6 minute shooting took place, certainly did not protect those children. Why would you expect someone else to protect you, when you are the best person to protect yourself. Edited February 24, 2018 by Anomaly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearing Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, nicksep said: US have literally x4 more per person i cant seem to find that 1:4ratio - source please? Edited February 24, 2018 by gearing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alek Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 3 minutes ago, Jordan said: The legal problem with gun control laws is they are restricted by due process. We shouldn't discuss no-fly lists for example as it would require the 5th and 14th amendments would have to be repealed. I'm not sure you're using due process correctly in that context Gun laws, just like all other laws, are regulated at the federal, state, and local levels. The state can restrict freedoms but not grant more freedoms than the federal government. For instance, in New York you might just be flat-out rejected for a firearm if you live in New York City, whereas you can get one by driving an hour north in the same state. In the case of marijuana use, it's a special case. Here we do in fact have the state granting more freedoms than the federal government. To this day, it is still very illegal for anyone to smoke weed at the federal level. When states started legalizing it, Obama made a mandate saying that he will not prosecute citizens of these crimes they are committing in states where its legal. Not sure how I got to this topic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, Anomaly said: It was and has been proven wrong; that you actually cannot "go into an gun show and purchase a gun without showing ID". To talk about Stoneman, the system failed. There were 3 police ON SITE during the course of the shooting and they did nothing to stop the shooter. Among the 30+ calls to the police warning of this living devil. Take away his guns maybe? Might of worked, but than logically speaking, whats stopping him from creating bombs and amassing the same amount of dead if not more? The point is guns don't kill people, people kill people. The argument that we need weapons to protect yourself is very valid. Refer to the genocide that killed over ~6 million jews. With someone like trump as your president mocking other countrys, why would you not want some way to protect yourself.... the sheriffs at Stoneman who were on site well the 6 minute shooting took place, certainly did not protect those children. Why would you expect someone else to protect you, when you are the best person to protect yourself. i partially agree with that, but no developed first world country has as many homicides as america : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate America making it so easy to obtain guns, and how often its portrayed in the media just gives people incentive to do it, no second thoughts. If you are to go and blow up your school that requires a lot of money, contacts, way more risk, just a lot of hassle. A gun you just take some money from your parents wallet, pawn something whatever it is, buy a gun or heck even take one of your relatives and go in and shoot some people up. Much simpler, obtaining a gun can be done in less than a day, while building a bomb to blow up a school requires months of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 2 minutes ago, nicksep said: i partially agree with that, but no developed first world country has as many homicides as america : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate America making it so easy to obtain guns, and how often its portrayed in the media just gives people incentive to do it, no second thoughts. If you are to go and blow up your school that requires a lot of money, contacts, way more risk, just a lot of hassle. A gun you just take some money from your parents wallet, pawn something whatever it is, buy a gun or heck even take one of your relatives and go in and shoot some people up. Much simpler, obtaining a gun can be done in less than a day, while building a bomb to blow up a school requires months of work. You can Google how to make a pipe bomb, than proceed to a Home Depot to purchase all needed supplies, all in the same day. And it's probably going to be cheaper than purchasing a rifle. Guns don't kill people, deranged people kill people. A real solution to preventing Stoneman like shootings, is a more strict background check on anyone purchasing a fire-arm, and proper gun training for on site armed guards of schools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 9 minutes ago, gearing said: i cant seem to find that 1:4ratio - source please? why do you post a sigh image? Pretty disrespectful, you can't bare to have a civilised discussion? i mean stay ignorant and misinformed just like the typical american who's riding on trumps cock while your countries kids end up with bullets through their skulls due to pathetic conservative, manipulated people like you. Really disgusting as a nation to allow this to happen to your kids and just stand by and ignore it because you rather own a gun than keep your country safer http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/switzerland http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/united-states 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 3 minutes ago, Anomaly said: You can Google how to make a pipe bomb, than proceed to a Home Depot to purchase all needed supplies, all in the same day. And it's probably going to be cheaper than purchasing a rifle. Guns don't kill people, deranged people kill people. A real solution to preventing Stoneman like shootings, is a more strict background check on anyone purchasing a fire-arm, and proper gun training for on site armed guards of schools. you can literally build a gun yourself and have nobody know of it and not be registered anywhere while requiring no background checks. funny how you ignored the fact that america has more murders per capita, i guess it could be just your nation as a whole is more "deranged" as you say, but this seems like the less likely option for me. I don't remember when the last time someone blew up their school with a pipe bomb. Regardless a pipe bomb wouldn't spring into kids mind, taking their daddys gun is easier, once the first shot leaves that chamber theres no going back, or second thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ez11 Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 4 minutes ago, Anomaly said: proper gun training for on site armed guards of schools. wtf do you guys actually have armed guards in your schools? ignoring how ridiculous that is, do you also have airport security at the entrance of your schools? Otherwise security wouldnt really do a lot to stop a school shooter since he can just walk i say hi to the guard and when hes infront of the classroom he pulls out his gun and kills the people he wants dead. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearing Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, nicksep said: why do you post a sigh image? Pretty disrespectful, you can't bare to have a civilised discussion? i mean stay ignorant and misinformed just like the typical american who's riding on trumps cock while your countries kids end up with bullets through their skulls due to pathetic conservative, manipulated people like you. Really disgusting as a nation to allow this to happen to your kids and just stand by and ignore it because you rather own a gun than keep your country safer http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/switzerland http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/united-states thanks for the links, i dont know what is that you are trying to attain in the first part though especially after ranting about some 'civilised discussion', go breath some fresh air; hypocrite;) p.s.: thanks to the media coverage everyone is going to rant about this for a while now, this could be an important issue, though im convinced IT IS NOT amongst the TOP10 of our problems, sure, if you want to be mad about something, this is as good as anything else Edited February 24, 2018 by gearing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 1 minute ago, nicksep said: you can literally build a gun yourself and have nobody know of it and not be registered anywhere while requiring no background checks. funny how you ignored the fact that america has more murders per capita, i guess it could be just your nation as a whole is more "deranged" as you say, but this seems like the less likely option for me. I don't remember when the last time someone blew up their school with a pipe bomb. Regardless a pipe bomb wouldn't spring into kids mind, taking their daddys gun is easier, once the first shot leaves that chamber theres no going back, or second thoughts also i'd be really interested to find out where i can make a fail proof pipe bomb with directions from the internet and all needed supplies from a home depot that will have a large enough kill radius to fatally get as many people as gunning down a bunch of kids. A tiny home made pipe bomb if you are lucky enough to find how and everything you need to make one, won't actually kill as much people, but more so injure. You won't have a way out e.g. by shooting yourself in the head once you had enough, and its much less satisfying and less reason / reward for the person to do it as they won't directly face the person and see their face at the moment of death which i would assume is a big reason, to see their bully or whoever they are killing feel pain, and their face in their dying moments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicksep Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 4 minutes ago, gearing said: thanks for the links, i dont know what is that you are trying to attain in the first part though especially after ranting about some 'civilised discussion', go breath some fresh air; hypocrite;) p.s.: thanks to the media coverage everyone is going to rant about this for a while now, this could be an important issue, though im convinced IT IS NOT amongst the TOP10 of our problems, sure, if you want to be mad about something, this is as good as anything else seems like an excuse to not ban guns, and personally i have some doubt in the florida school shooting and could potentially be a push to ban guns, but i don't disagree with manipulating / using subversion on the population for their own benefit yuri bezemenov in my opinion is relevant to this topic, interested interview and would suggest you watch it. If you dont agree subversion is happening in the US thats really ignorant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ez11 said: wtf do you guys actually have armed guards in your schools? ignoring how ridiculous that is, do you also have airport security at the entrance of your schools? Otherwise security wouldnt really do a lot to stop a school shooter since he can just walk i say hi to the guard and when hes infront of the classroom he pulls out his gun and kills the people he wants dead. A lot of schools have armed guards, including the one at Stoneman. I feel like a lot of people on the left do no research, besides what they read on Facebook. Go ahead and tell me US needs to institute Australian gun laws next as per your Facebook ads... @nicksep EDIT: I do not support Trump, don't Skype me that trash. lol Edited February 24, 2018 by Anomaly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 TRUMP WILL MAKE AMERIKKKA GREAT!~!!!!!!!! /s HE HAS A SolUTiON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
