Gun Violence (in America).

[Mordred]

As I live in Australia, it's kinda weird to think what it's like for all of you. Probably sucks though. Unless you're @Night

[Boxxy]

14 hours ago, IlliniGuy said:

Look at the UK, no guns so tons of knife attacks which is more gruesome and more suffering than a gun attack (given that criminals will always exist) 

There are plenty of guns in the UK, my town is known for having a huge legit gun trade, nothing illegal about owning guns when you have the correct licenses. The only guns you can't get are full autos and small hand guns. If a kid wanted to get a gun they'd have no problem in doing so.

When was the last school shooting in the uk? 13 March 1996.. When was the last school shooting in the US? April 20th 2018 and there have been 17 in 2018 so far..

I'm sorry but you don't see someone with a knife running around stabbing everyone in a school or in a concert like someone in call of duty with commando pro. Yes there are knife crime and stabbings but they are normally single target attacks or gang vs gang. But idk, kids here don't go into schools wanting to kill everyone. That's obviously a mental thing, the weapon is just an enabler

Edited May 11, 2018 by Boxxy
forgot something

[RoomScape]

8 hours ago, Jackthedon said:

Google can do a better job of telling you than myself. I'll also say with confidence (without checking) that each of those will have some benefits, particularly in medicine.

The point is that blanket statements cause the majority of arguments and misunderstandings. If you truly believed that then you're a little bit misinformed, but I'd wager you didn't do any legwork with regards to the statement you made, which isn't necessarily your fault given how much time it'd take. If everyone's strong opinions were only given on topics about which they were learned then the world would operate much smoother.

Ok so I just reread your initial comment and you’re taking what I said out of context. 

Theres an obvious difference between the drug Advil and the drug cocaine and methamphetamine which are both used as street drugs. I didn’t say to get rid of drugs for medicinal use, I was referring to the street drugs as that’s what was being mentioned. 

Also, going back to your previous comment, I am open minded and I like sharing different opinions. Just because I hear a different opinion doesn’t mean I agree with it. If you tell me your opinion and it’s factually wrong then I will disagree unless you point something out to me countering what I know. Contrary, if you tell me your opinion and I don’t agree with it, then I won’t agree with it just because you said so as it’s against my opinion. So unless you give me statements to back your opinion, I won’t just go along with you with anything you say. 

I like to hear the opinions of others, whether or not I agree with it. I just don’t like hearing factually incorrect opinions. But if you have an opinion then that’s your responsibility to prove me wrong so that I can potentially change my opinion. I’m not just going to change the way I think because some guy online (or any guy) tells me that they want me to think another way. 

[LeBron]

9 hours ago, RoomScape said:

I can tell that you’re not American by your replies. 

The consitution wasn’t made by politicians. I don’t know how else to tell you this. You’re not American and don’t know of American history yet you’re telling me about American history? I don’t get it. 

 

I can tell you are indeed American by your replies. George Washington is one of the founding fathers, he was among the people who wrote the constitution and he was a politian. 

Clearly you don't need to be an American to know basica American history but just because you are an American doesn't mean that you know it. 

[RoomScape]

9 minutes ago, LeBron said:

I can tell you are indeed American by your replies. George Washington is one of the founding fathers, he was among the people who wrote the constitution and he was a politian. 

Clearly you don't need to be an American to know basica American history but just because you are an American doesn't mean that you know it. 

Tell me about his political party and his political views, then. You keep telling me he is without any proof whatsoever and you just repeat yourself. I can tell you’re indeed ignorant due to your replies of something you don’t know. 

[LeBron]

9 minutes ago, RoomScape said:

Tell me about his political party and his political views, then. You keep telling me he is without any proof whatsoever and you just repeat yourself. I can tell you’re indeed ignorant due to your replies of something you don’t know. 

https://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21578653-virtues-pragmatic-founding-father-are-much-missed-nowadays-george-washington

You're asking for proof that water is wet, holy shit you're next level <Idontwantaforumban>. 

Edited May 11, 2018 by LeBron

[RoomScape]

9 hours ago, overboardsea123s said:

Arent opioid derivatives use in pain med?

You guys are missing what I’m talking about. All drugs as far as I know are medicinal derivatives. I’m talking about the drugs sold on the streets. Those are not for medical use. 

8 hours ago, childrenfirst said:

"1v1 me"  

honestly you people shouldnt own guns, you make the rest of us look like dickheads 

It was halfway a joke. 

Also, what makes you think that I own a gun?

7 hours ago, ez11 said:

Point is you claim police brutality skyrockets when police doesnt have to worry about everyone having a gun to "defend" themselves (which doest make any sense either since they can see if you have a gun in your hand or not) but in germany police brutality isnt insane even though we dont carry guns with us everywhere we go (which most americans dont do either so its questionable how much your gun laws actually matter.

If you think usa not having guns would work differently than other first world countrys without guns, then guns or not owning them isnt your primary issue that you need to focus on.

This isn’t Germany. The police in America are brutal regardless. They’re using guns as an excuse but that’s just their mentality. While I’m aware that there are good cops, there’s a lot of bad and corrupt cops also and those are the ones I’m talking about. You can’t compare America to a lot of other countries and this topic wasn’t meant to compare America with other countries so please stop doing that. 

https://www.vox.com/cards/police-brutality-shootings-us/us-police-shootings-statistics

if you want to compare read that. The majority of police killings are against unarmed civilians. The percentage of Americans that own guns are also low. Think it’s 20% or something. 

6 hours ago, U my xp said:

Be like Australia and ban automatics . 

I don’t know about that. Wouldn’t necessarily be against it but who knows. I just think we need to have stricter gun laws background checks. 

4 hours ago, THS said:

America has a mental health problem not a gun problem.

So true. We just like to hide it instead of talking about it. 

3 hours ago, CJ7 said:

Would it not be practically impossible to ban guns in the US? Given the amount of legal weapons already bought and the circulation of illegal weapons? The costs of that would be ridiculous too.

I must say I'm not from the US, but comparing it to the Dutch drug policy, if we were to ban soft drugs, there would still be a ridiculous amount of weed/mushrooms in circulation, because soft drug use is almost embedded in Dutch society. Now I know it might be a illogical comparison, since drugs are a one-time use and then you'd have to buy again and given the addictive effects of some drugs, but I hope you get the point.

Again, you can ban guns but only the law abiding citizens will get rid of it. The criminals and ones who got it illegally will not hand them over since they technically don’t own any. On top of that, there’s a large group of gun owners who would probably fight (literally) than to hand over their guns. 

3 hours ago, liverare said:

 

School shootings are an American phenomenon and going by the stats starting from 2010 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States#2010–2014), a little Excel later and the average number of fatalities in school shootings is 1.05 and average injuries is 1.62. It's only ever the mass murders, like at Sandy Hook and Douglas High School that get any real kind of media attention. I won't bother comparing those numbers to the numbers of deaths by vehicles, cancer, obesity world wide. For shit and giggles, let's say the total number to-date of all murders and injuries in school shootings has reached 1 million, that's still a piss in the ocean when the population of USA is estimated around 320 million. So it's rare and it's inconsequential. Even the other mass murders by shootings adds fuck all to the overall numbers. Shootings are rare and inconsequential, but when they do happen, it's by and large gang-related violence, or suicide by cop. It's certainly not worth burning the 2nd amendment over.

But this is the perfect example to use for trying to get rid of guns. While I’m not condoning it or saying it’s good in any way, when it does happen it’s extremely rare and the deaths are low. 

But here’s another thing. Why do you think kids go to shoot up their old schools? There’s obviously something that happened to them there that people don’t ever bring up. The number of sex abuse that goes on in schools is frightening and the majority of it is never reported or found. Teachers raping students and students raping students. On top of the bullying that occurs at practically every school, it’s no surprise a student gets pissed and goes to shoot it up. 

The reason why it’s mainly males is because girls are weaker, mentally. They’ll do something small like commit suicide or just cry. Guys will get mad and go fight and it’s really not hard to get a gun due to the bs laws so they go for revenge. If you were bullied to the extreme or raped by teachers and no one was there to help you, wouldn’t you blame the entire school? I think that’s what happened more than anything. 

[RoomScape]

17 minutes ago, LeBron said:

https://www.economist.com/news/united-states/21578653-virtues-pragmatic-founding-father-are-much-missed-nowadays-george-washington

You're asking for proof that water is wet, holy shit you're next level <Idontwantaforumban>. 

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/george-washingtons-views-political-parties-america/

[Taims]

16 hours ago, D Bolter said:

I believe there should be stronger gun control even if it means abolishing them permanently. With civilians not possessing firearms, the police don't have to fear for their lives as much and can't give the excuse "oh he had a gun on him". So I think police brutality would decrease. There are many alternatives to guns: we could use pepper spray, tasers, etc.

I live in Finland, and we have possibly the lowest rate of "shots fired by police" in the world. In 2013 Finnish police shot only 6 times (https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/finnish_police_fired_guns_only_six_times_in_2013/7701005), and these 6 shots are from all the policemen COMBINED in a ~5 million population country. The reason for this is probably that if a policeman shoots their weapon, they have to go through an insane amount of paperwork conserning why did they shoot etc., and usually court too. So they actually only shoot when it's their last option. Also when a policeman fires his gun, it ALWAYS makes the top of national news immediately and remains as that for a couple of weeks at least.

They do carry tasers nowadays as you've mentioned, and they use them in situations when they can't get someone under control or arrested anyway else.

We also have VERY strict gun laws. No-one (except for policemen in duty) has the right to carry a firearm (or pretty much any weapon for that matter) in open in a public area. Also if you want purchase a firearm, you have to go through shooting training, and through a very specific examination by the police/government to get the license to purchase a gun. Basically if you've done pretty much any type of crime besides traffic violation in your past, you will NOT be able to purchase a firearm (legally).

This hasn't solved the problem of violence unfortunately. We've had several mass shootings (including school shootings) in the past 30 years. There are over half a million reported crimes each year (keep in mind there is only around 5 million people living here) in Finland according to the Ministry of the Interior (http://intermin.fi/en/police/crime-in-finland). And although firearms aren't easily acceptable legally, there is a LOT of firearms (especially from the WW2 era) still in circulation in "underground" markets. Also every summer many summer cabins are broken into and the main target for these robbers are usually hunting rifles and other firearms, because they hold such a high value in the black market. Also many people carry conceiled knives, peppersprays, tasers and other weapons in a possible situation where they need to protect themselves. And I guess we might be somewhat a notorious nation when it comes to barehanded violence (which is in many cases influenced by "Koskenkorva" ).

So as we are in about all time low when it comes to police brutality and an all time high for gun control, our problem with crime and violence remains. 

[LeBron]

2 hours ago, RoomScape said:

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/george-washingtons-views-political-parties-america/

Game. Set. Match. 

[RoomScape]

6 minutes ago, LeBron said:

Game. Set. Match. 

Not sure what you're talking about but ok.

[LeBron]

11 minutes ago, RoomScape said:

Not sure what you're talking about but ok.

Red = political experience

Grey = military experience

Now take a look at George Washington on the top and stop replying to me. 

Edited May 11, 2018 by LeBron

[Wave]

I agree with you for the most part. The right to bear arms is in the Constitution but I feel like there should be a longer process in order to own a gun. More background checks etc should be implemented, other than that I think guns should be allowed.

[RoomScape]

On 5/11/2018 at 3:32 PM, PapaMerch said:

I agree with you for the most part. The right to bear arms is in the Constitution but I feel like there should be a longer process in order to own a gun. More background checks etc should be implemented, other than that I think guns should be allowed.

Yeah, there should be certain people who shouldn’t be allowed to own a gun. But considering someone to have mental issues is another problem as there’s scientifically - as far as I know - no basis for mental health. So technically, the government can label someone as one with mental issues and they’ll be banned from being able to own a gun. Other than that I don’t have a problem. It should be strict and certain felons definitely shouldn’t be able to own one. 

[RoomScape]

On 5/11/2018 at 10:33 AM, Taims said:

I live in Finland, and we have possibly the lowest rate of "shots fired by police" in the world. In 2013 Finnish police shot only 6 times (https://yle.fi/uutiset/osasto/news/finnish_police_fired_guns_only_six_times_in_2013/7701005), and these 6 shots are from all the policemen COMBINED in a ~5 million population country. The reason for this is probably that if a policeman shoots their weapon, they have to go through an insane amount of paperwork conserning why did they shoot etc., and usually court too. So they actually only shoot when it's their last option. Also when a policeman fires his gun, it ALWAYS makes the top of national news immediately and remains as that for a couple of weeks at least.

They do carry tasers nowadays as you've mentioned, and they use them in situations when they can't get someone under control or arrested anyway else.

We also have VERY strict gun laws. No-one (except for policemen in duty) has the right to carry a firearm (or pretty much any weapon for that matter) in open in a public area. Also if you want purchase a firearm, you have to go through shooting training, and through a very specific examination by the police/government to get the license to purchase a gun. Basically if you've done pretty much any type of crime besides traffic violation in your past, you will NOT be able to purchase a firearm (legally).

This hasn't solved the problem of violence unfortunately. We've had several mass shootings (including school shootings) in the past 30 years. There are over half a million reported crimes each year (keep in mind there is only around 5 million people living here) in Finland according to the Ministry of the Interior (http://intermin.fi/en/police/crime-in-finland). And although firearms aren't easily acceptable legally, there is a LOT of firearms (especially from the WW2 era) still in circulation in "underground" markets. Also every summer many summer cabins are broken into and the main target for these robbers are usually hunting rifles and other firearms, because they hold such a high value in the black market. Also many people carry conceiled knives, peppersprays, tasers and other weapons in a possible situation where they need to protect themselves. And I guess we might be somewhat a notorious nation when it comes to barehanded violence (which is in many cases influenced by "Koskenkorva" ).

So as we are in about all time low when it comes to police brutality and an all time high for gun control, our problem with crime and violence remains. 

I like the idea of police paperwork for every shooting. I’m not sure how it works here but it sounds like a pain to shoot your gun as a cop.