Dispute Lloyd

[darkkjer]

Lloyd (@ http://osbot.org/forum/user/60900-lloyd/) scammed me and other on this site quite a while ago since he was already banned and gone before i had the chance dispute him, i didn't reported him. 

Back before he scammed everyone i paid him 90$ to make me an 90/97/90 staker i paid him in advance but he never finished/delivered the account, as he was suddenly banned for scamming others.

 

Proof: https://gyazo.com/59ff536da74ad5050b6b3843ae736ebf

https://gyazo.com/add61b972c9e6328f7b307aff580e6bc

[ProjectPact]

This user, @@Lloyd, has been placed in TWC already, but I will request him to post here. Have you tried contacting him about the status of your account?

Lloyd (@ http://osbot.org/forum/user/60900-lloyd/) scammed me and other on this site quite a while ago since he was already banned and gone before i had the chance dispute him, i didn't reported him. 

Back before he scammed everyone i paid him 90$ to make me an 90/97/90 staker i paid him in advance but he never finished/delivered the account, as he was suddenly banned for scamming others.

 

Proof: https://gyazo.com/59ff536da74ad5050b6b3843ae736ebf

https://gyazo.com/add61b972c9e6328f7b307aff580e6bc

 

[darkkjer]

 

This user, @@Lloyd, has been placed in TWC already, but I will request him to post here. Have you tried contacting him about the status of your account?

 

Not recently no, i'll contact him

[ProjectPact]

Not recently no, i'll contact him

 

Try contacting the user, but there are no promises he will answer or even give an account to you. The user is being banned for recently openly admitting to scam quitting and will not be allowed back unless they pay the people they have scammed, including your full amount. 

 

 

Hopefully this encourages you to either user a middle man, not paying a full amount until something is done, or even making sure the user is trusted.

 

 

I'm sorry for your loss. Hopefully he will contact you and give you the account. I'm not sure if it is too late to dispute the payment or not, most likely is, but since he openly admitted in scam quitting, I would go ahead and try that. UNLESS HE IS GIVING YOU AN ACCOUNT THAT YOU PURCHASED, OR A REPLACEMENT ACCOUNT.

 

Also, please note how important it is to start a report soon after something has happened. This case should have been made LONG before now. It should have been first brought up in 2014, not two years later. You're lucky the user recently openly admitted to scam quitting and got banned, or else this case probably would have not gone through and no actions would have been taken to the user. So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE try to open a dispute right when you think things are getting fishy.

 

Please let me know if there is anything I can do to further assist you.

 

 

Thanks,

 

ProjectPact

[Solution]

User unbanned so he can reply to the dispute.
The previous report of him scam quitting (the one he admitted to) was already cleared up, which resulted in him being unbanned and placed in TWC.

[Rianne]

[images hidden by @Solution]
Hey all lloyd here, sorry was on holliday that why i didn't reply in time.

my account is still banned or something so using my gf account for this To clean up this stuff.

So first of all he say i owe him 90$? right.

 

Lets start from the start.
He was a good customer of me.

He ordered alot of rs gp and accounts from me, I always delivered everything to him.

When I quit scam 2 ppl and got banned on OSBOT he chargedback all his paypal transactions from me also for the orders i already did for him or the order he bought gold of me.

And he told paypal that his creditcard was stolen. so he won the case with paypal and i lost like 255euro because of that.

 

The proof:

 

SO first of all the e-mail with paypal about the chargeback its dutch and please keep the picture private:

 

 

It also says i am chargedback in the mail so my paypal account is in debt with money.....i removed almost all money of my account when i quit rs

so that why i got in debt. you can read it also in the mail that its chargedback.

if you wanna see the orginal mail give a shout and i send it.

 

the picture there where in the mail that he used his brother paypal account to pay.

 

tried to proof he used his brothers account for paypal but paypal told me if he charge back virtual good they cannot help because he charge back on his creditcard so i lost the case in it.

 

here a post of the picture what he charge back total:

 

 

if you read the e-mail it also say he charged back.

in total he payed me: 345$

I didn't finish his account because he charged all back.

so basically if you take away the 90$ he OWES me the 255 euro what he total charged back on the service and the gold he bought from me.

I never made a dispute or anything because i was banned for scam quit 2 ppl.

what is paid back at the end. that why i got unbanned.

I never finished his order because he chargedback all and after that he removed me from skype.

I lose the case because its virtual goods and he told his credicart company his creditcard got stolen.

 

So all together:

He owes me 255euro.

He is trying to get a free account or money back now.

All the pictures of skype i got from the paypal e-mail

Happy i saved that e-mail.

 

If you guys need to know anything more give a shout to me,

I think fair way is that he need to pay me back, for all that he charged back.

Like i told i never disputed because i was banned and now he started i will dispute him dont know if i need to make a new dispute or not?

 

Greetings lloyd

 

 

 

 

[Rianne]

[images hidden]

the last proof that paypal telling the charge back + prive and time + screen of paypal date.

i lost the case at september. so that why its chargedback in september because they where reasearching the case.

but here the proof he charge back all the orders he did at me what i also finish for him.

[Solution]

@Lloyd has shown proof of all payments being charged back, even those that were completed. @@darkkjer will have to refund the money for these orders.
The total is €255, considering the decently high amount I will give the user 96 hours to refund. Please update me when this has been completed.

I've placed @darkkjer in TWC until this has been completed.

[Lloyd]

You know 255 $ is allot money,,,,

I don't even know why you would start a dispute,,, if you just can tell me the reason of it and why you try to get 90$ or an account if you  just chargeback all..

if you just telling the true and the reason of it I would agree whit 100m.

I aint a hard guy, but don't like it if you just lie to get something free, so if you can tell me the true.

I will agree whit 100m if the mods say thats fine.

​People making mistakes and the deserve a secon chanse.

Like the mods  gived me another try

 

 

[Solution]

You know 255 $ is allot money,,,,

I don't even know why you would start a dispute,,, if you just can tell me the reason of it and why you try to get 90$ or an account if you  just chargeback all..

if you just telling the true and the reason of it I would agree whit 100m.

I aint a hard guy, but don't like it if you just lie to get something free, so if you can tell me the true.

I will agree whit 100m if the mods say thats fine.

​People making mistakes and the deserve a secon chanse.

Like the mods  gived me another try

 

 If you can live with 100m refund then that's totally fine with me. Glad you're not holding a grudge.

[darkkjer]

DISCLAIMER: I wrote this in a hurry, so there might be some typos/badly written parts, u can alsway ask questions

 

Ok since Lloyd got the chance to adress the whole situation i think i should have a chance to adress the whole situation aswell. I have to say i WILL NOT PAY BACK LLOYD,explanation:

 

First off what lloyd said in this post is almost all true. Yes i chargebacked everyhting. But let me explain why.

 

HERE'S THE WHOLE COMPLETE AND CORRECT SITUATION(Some small details who do not matter have been left out):

 

I was always a good customer(as Lloyd said), always paid upfront even if i had to wait a while for some goods.
As lloyd said i used my borthers paypal as I didn't have paypal/credit card that could be linked to paypal yet, so i paid my brother in cash so he would pay the goods to Lloyd with his paypal for me.

As you can probably image this was quite annoying to involve my borther in all of this. So i convinced Lloyd( since i already trusted him at this point) to try paysafecard codes as a payment, we tested it, it worked out for both of us so this was a lot easier from now on instead of having to involve my borther each time. However this means that i no longer had proof of the payment because i just gave him a code via skype and he would give me the 07gp equivalent. Since I had already ordered over 300Euro from him  with paypal, he wouldnt scam me, right?

 

At first every trade with the paysafecard codes were smooth,i gave hima code via skype, he traded me the money on rs, it even became a habbit. Then i even got to the point were i trusted Lloyd so much that i introduced one of my irl friends, who was not an osbot member but who was looking to buy some gp aswell, to Lloyd. So basically i even got him an extra customer by telling a good friend of me this Lloyd guy was so trusted he should give his money to him to get the gp he wanted without ever getting scammed. I said that to one of my friends. I specifically said he wouldnt get scammed by Lloyd. And what do you know , the first few trades Lloyd DID pay my friend aswell to the point were even my friend started to gain some trust aswell, making him pay more and larger amounts.

 

And then i even convinced a second friend, who was really scared to get scammed, to buy gp from Lloyd, he gave me 50 euro psc so i could buy 07 gp from Lloyd for him. So i did, i gave Lloyd 50Euro psc from my 2nd friend, 50euro psc from me and at the very same moment my first friend paid 100 psc aswell.

 

This is the moment were Lloyd scam quit. He said he only scam quit 2 people, but the also scammed quit me and my irl friends(yes this was dumb to get my irl friends involved but at the time Lloyd had built up enough trust that i thought he woudlnt scam, guess i was wrong).

 

So basically: He scam quit me and my friends for 200 euro psc+ 90 euro account. (Plus im not sure about this part but i think that first friend had at this moment also already ordered the same stake account as i did but im not sure about this part so ill leave this out)

 

Now these 2 friends got to trust him because of me, from the 2nd quy it was even his very first trade ever and he got scammed right away, as you can image they both werent really happy about this and kinda took this out on me. Yes they stared to blame me and i felt bad for them,since i convinced them to give their money to Lloyd. So since they were  mad at me i had to pay them back myself. They started to avoid me aswell and not trust me anymore, just because Lloyd was so greedy he decided to scam quit. 

 

NOW let's say you're in my situation: You and your friends got scammed, your friends blame you for this. The guy who scamquit already got banned and doesnt reply(i didnt just delete him, like lloyd claims, i even tried to get in contact with him which should be obv cuz i just got fcking scammed). SO i have 2 options:

1) i pay my friends back from my very own pocket cuz the scammer wont give it back

or 2) try and chargeback previous paypal payments from the scammer that qause you all the trouble  and that way psooibly get my money back.

And guess what? logically i went for options 2, cuz i wasnt gonna pay for lloyd's deeds.

 

Now at this point i was already of going thru all this shit and now i had to involve my brother again to be able to chargeback everything. Obv i had to explain him the situation and convince him to let me try to chargeback( which was a pain in the ass cuz he was scared he was about to get somehow scammed aswell after hearing the story). And then i havent even talked about the pain in the ass which was convinving paypal to chargeback which took me lika   good 2months of hard effort.

 

NOW you probably want proof for all of this but ill be honest and tell i dont really have any the reason, but heres why you should believe me:

 

1) its been over 2 years and a lot has changed, i dont have the same pc anymore, i dont have the skype messages from and to Lloyd anymore( unless you guys now an archive of some sort but i couldnt find any, if u do pleasy tell me that way i can happily proff evrything i just said)

 

2) the only proof which i did have was skype messages anyway cuz evry psc transaction ever happend thru skype, and since we arent friends anymore i couldnt find i way to get to the messages, ill try

 

3) I've been a member of osbot for quite a lon time and NEVER EVER had ANY problems WITH ANYONE i've ever traded,

remember its still Lloyd who scamquit not me i never did anything.
 

4)I know Lloyd knows this is true and if he has the balls he'll confirm what i said and atleast that way restore he could restore some of his reputation

 

SO in the end i got my money back and should have nothing to complain aboutif only it werent for 2friends i lost just because Lloyd was a greedy mofo, i'll be honest i should never have claimed another dispute against Lloyd because i already had my money back, but i mistakenly tought he still owed my 90 for the account because i had not realized that that was also succesfully chargebacked. And soon after i claimed a dispute and realized i was wrong i even PM'd lloyd with my apologies because i had wrongfully disputed him.

 

Now i know its my word against Lloyd's word and wathever the osbot mods decide, im happy with either of the decision.

decision1: if they realise there's no way im lying about this, im happy to keep around on this site, and as for Lloyd in that case, i have my moneyback so i dont really care about him, although imo its stupid that someone who tried to scamquit can comeback eventho everyone got his money back. that does not take away that he still tried to scamquit.

 

decision2: if they think the word of a guy who scammed is worth more than the word of a loyal osbot-member(and just because im not that active or have less transactions completed doesnt take away im still more loyal and "nicer"than Lloyd)then i'll happily take a perm ban cuz then i would definatly never want to be faced with a community again in which the mods take the word of a scammer over the word of a loyal member.

 

 

 

[Solution]

We base our actions on evidence, and so far you are unable to provide the tiniest bit of it.
Somebody's word is worth nothing when they have zero evidence to back up their claims. Rank and registration date have no influence in this.
Do you have anything to back up your claims about the psc trades?

I've also requested Lloyd to reply here.

[Lloyd]

First of all i cant find your 'i claimed a dispute and realized i was wrong i even PM'd lloyd with my apologies because i had wrongfully disputed him.'

When did u send an apologies? and where?

 

Its true u gived me 1 more customer and he payed total of 100euro paysafecard for like 50m or something .

(the other friend of you I never spoken but you did trade for him the gold )

He bough also gold from me yes, and he wanted to buy another account like you.

But he didn't had they money yet to buy it,,,, but I started alreddy for him in good trust,

I never scammed ur friends our you, I didn't continue whit ur acc when u started the chargeback on me, took me allot of time to fight that chargeback and lost it.

 

so basically you still own me money.

You charged all back. also for ALLL the gold I sold you.

lets say 2 acc is 180 $ right and I didn't deliver it like you said.( I am sure he didn't pay at all yet ur friend for the acc but if he did its 180$ but its 2 years ago so can be i missing something or cant remember)

 

paypal chargeback is 345.   -180= 165$ of gold you bought from me

SO still you own me 165$

I know some year have been passed and no hard feelings,

I came back on osbot because my gf wanted me to play osrs.

They give me another chance.

 

and $$$$$ is for me not any issue, and this all is a littlebit drame for something what happen over 2 years ago,

I will agree whit 50m at the lowest.

Because i always delivered every gold to you only not the account.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[darkkjer]

Since i didnt know if you were active or not and wanted to confess my mistake to mods aswell i sent it to Solution.

https://gyazo.com/99be3ee956aec05b2989cacbc3fbe8f6

 

And yes u did scam the very last psc-codes from me and my friends just before u quit and I'll try my very best to get proof of some mesages in which its clear im trading psc-codes for gp, but for now it seems impossible to get them. As for your evidence, its just me paying you and charging it back, that doesnt proof you didnt scam me. That only proofs that i paid you and wanted it back for a reason, i wonder why that was?

 

And you are complaining about how hard is was to fight those chargebacks? Thats funny, my brother and one of the guys barely trust me nowadays, all because you felt like scamquiting was a good idea.

[darkkjer]

Oh and btw i don't do this cuz i wanted money( i even said this to one of the mods)  i do this because eventho i trusted you back then u just bashed into me for no reason, all i really wanted was just a confession or a reason or something, it could have even been private between us two but now that you're back you still didnt even bother pm'ing me anything.